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| Ancestor Gateway Forum - STAMFORD MEMORIES GATEWAY (Lincolnshire England) used as PRIDE and PREJUDICE FILM SET | New Topic | Search |
| roger hardingham |
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I lived in Stamford in the late 1960s to mid 1970s. My grandparents ran Hardingham's Sports and Toy shop in Ironmonger Street. I am making a DVD film about the history of Stamford. I am trying to find old archive films of the town and immediate area. I will be filming the town soon as it is today. but I would love to hear from anyone who has, or knows, of any films that I could use. Kate: Oh yes, Roger. I remember Hardinghams well. They also sold the official school uniforms, badges, nametapes etc. Can anyone help Roger in his hunt for old films or clips? |
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| Paul Reedman |
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There is Lincolnshire film archives that have a couple of Stamford films including the King's visit in the early part of last century. They have a website and a list of whats available. Is your DVD for sale and if so I'd be really interested in getting a copy. |
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| Paul Reedman |
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Forgot to ask if you needed any help with your research as there's loads of people on here that can give you additional information. |
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| roger hardingham |
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My grandparents ran the shop in Ironmonger Street. My favourite time there as a child was Christmas when all the Horby Railway sets were being stacked iup ready for sale! Does anyone have a photo of 12 Ironmonger Street Hardingham's shop? |
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| Roger Hardingham |
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Just a quick note to ask if the replies are showing on my piece about Old Film? I cant see them when I look? Roger Kate: Yes Roger, I found that you had received replies. Should be visible now. |
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| roger hardingham |
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Paul, thank you for this information. I have in fact contacted the Lincolnshire archiive, but they say that the films cannot be used! My DVD will be for sale by the way. Roger |
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| roger hardingham |
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Paul, Thank you for the info. I might well need research assitants! The DVD will be on sale locally in late summer. Roger |
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| Kate |
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Roger - talking to someone else on the topic, they reminded me that there were in fact two Hardinghams shops in Ironmonger Street. The nice old fashioned one higher up the hill where the trainsets and toys were sold, and lower down a larger fronted shop where the clothes and school equipment were sold. Not sure when Hardinghams opened the larger shop or when they gave them up. Kate |
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| MIKE IRESON |
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Anglia TV did a series some years back called Anglia At War. The first episode had shots of Stamford in the 30,s. They may be able to help you. |
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| roger hardingham |
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Kate, Thanks, my grandparents ran only the Toy and Sports shop at No 12 till the mid 1970s, then John Rollinson took over the shop and then closed No 12 to open up lower down the street. He just did the sports items there though. Kate: O right Roger. Was his name John Rollings or Rollins? Not sure. Remember him well, very tall dark-haired guy. Maybe greying a bit now. |
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| roger hardingham |
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Just an update for those who might be wondering what has happened to the film I was making about Stamford! I am still in the research mode for old films and have been able to find some very nice, and historical films going back to the 1940s and 50s. Some local sources have come up trumps since I first spread the news of my search to the Mercury and through this great site. It's doubtful that I can complete the project for christmas, which was my first hope, but now intend to bring it out in the Spring. In the meantime, if anyone has any other idea for the quest in old films, please let me know. Many thanks, Roger Hardingham Kate: Sounds like you are making good progress Roger. Please keep us up-to-date with the launch of the film etc. Anyone know of any old films lurking in boxes undiscovered? |
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| Peter |
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There was something on You Tube a while ago about the Queen's visit to Stamford in 1958/59, I 'm sure there was a video of it. At the time we kids from Miss Green and Miss Smith's (Northfields Kindergarten) stood on a wall at the bottom of Tinwell Road and waved Union Jack flags. |
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| Clem Walden |
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Roger I remember Hardinghams I would go there for fishing tackle, line/hooks/reels & fireworks (on bonfire night) period being the 40s/50s, my father was a good friend of "Leu Hardingham" I remember even on Sundays when he was closed he would come down from above the shop where he lived & get me & my dad line/hooks when we were going fishing, I remember his daughter Cathy who was at the high school in the 50s. I also remember John Rollings, we played together as young boys,his family lived in St Leonards Street, John's sister Pat is still in Stamford, I see her occasionally down Blackstone Social Club. There father Jack Rollings & Williams ran the green grocers in the high street, (Rollings & Williams) 50s,60, not sure when it closed? John Rollings worked as an electrician at Westmorlands, later starting his own electrical business, which he sold, before taking over Hardinghams.I believe he was at that time living in New Cross road. As you say he moved location lower down Ironmonger Street into Woodhouse's furniture shop. When John left I believe Stuart Grey (who was a teacher at the Fane School) took over. John took over a pub in Ryhall,(The Millstone I believe) he was a good sportsman & a very good dart player, I believe he is still about, but have not seen him for several years, need to ask his sister Pat next time I see her. |
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| Roger hardingham |
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Thank you Clem. Sorry for the delay in replying! Yes my Grandad wa well known in the shop I am sure, Iwell recall gong in at Chritsmas particuarly seeing all the lovely train sets etc and Britains toys which I liked a lot. I am hoping to complete the film about Stamford by October 2008, is been quite a big project, but I hope people like it. Regards, Roger Hardingham |
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| Paul Reedman |
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Hi Roger could you post any details when it is ready and how I can get hold of a copy. Thanks Paul |
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| roger hardingham |
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Yes I will indeed. Hopefully WH Smiths and other shops will stock it. Roger |
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| Joan Stafford |
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Hello Clem, wasn't the shop further down Ironmonger Street called Woods, I remember buying a pushchair from there in 1970. |
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| roger hardingham |
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I thought I would add a note that I have now completed the DVD about Stamford. It runs to 54 minutes and has a mixture of archive films and modern footage! Archive includes, The Queen's visit in 1961, Lady Rowmayne Brassey opening the New Hall for Darby & Joan, carnivals in 1951 and 1967, railways, opening of the A1 by-pass, Stamford School speech day 1961, St Georges School, Mayors march through the town and much more! |
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| Paul Reedman |
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Where can we get a copy Roger and how much does it cost. Surely us Gateway readers should get a discount. hehe |
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| roger hardingham |
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HEhe, Yes Paul I'm sure we can do bulk orders! I hope that Walkers will sell it and Stamford Museum. It costs £12.95 |
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| John Cox |
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Hi Roger : I assume the DVD will be for Region 2 in PAL format but I should be able to play it on my computor right? Regards John |
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| roger hardingham |
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Hi all, My DVD is finally launched now after a rather protracted editing process. Hope you like it and enjoy the old archive films within it. Roger |
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| Clem Walden |
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Joan, you are correct it was "Woods" not Woodhouses as I stated Pamela my wife also corrected me, senior moment on my part, she also remembers purchasing a pram from Woods a "Silver Cross" dont see many of them these day's, did not Jill Cottrill marry the boy of Woods? Hardinghams moved to the shop after John Rollings took over, Woodhouses the furniture shop was in the High street, before it became Woodhouses I think it was "Oats & Mussons" perhaps someone can confirm this. |
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| Clem Walden |
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Hi-Roger, have seen the DVD and submit my comments. Wonder where you obtained all the information from? There seems to be various information that is incorrect and open to questions? (Like girls doing PT at Bluecoat School in North Street before it was moved to Green Lane?) The old Bluecoat School was in all Saints street and was a boys only school? (The Arts Centre was a Billards Hall) When? (Blackstones was famous for its agricultural machinery?) Engines Yes agricultural machinery no. (The Castle site levelled in 1935 for a bus station?) (Number 14 Barn Hill "The Old Hosken's Hotel" is described as being "Stukeley House" which was actually further up the Hill at number 9, this you describe as being the largest private house in Stamford? surely Barn Hill house must have been that? would have to say this DVD which I believe was produced by Kingfisher Productions and yourself in my opinion needs a second look. feel sure your granfather who I knew very well would also have a few questions to ask about this DVD. Should you wish to conact me about my observations please feel free to do so. |
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| Patrick |
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Sorry, Clem. Blackstones were famous for their agricultural implements as well as their diesel engines. Their horse-drawn rakes could be found on nearly every farm. I have spent many weary hours after harvest raking fields, sitting on the cast iron seat - with BLACKSTONE cast into the metalwork - and looking at the wrong end of the horse. |
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| betty |
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Sorry Clem Here we go again you are wrong Blackstones did do some Agricultural Machinery because I can take you to a place in "SAUGHTON" Mold, North Wales called "The Stables" which incidentally is next door to "MICHAEL OWENS" where you sit on Tractor seats with Blackstone's name on because I always comment on it. Also there is a "Mangold Cutter" in the museum at Hutton Hole, Yorkshire which is made by Blackstones. |
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| Clem Walden |
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Hi- Betty and Patrick, I believe all locals are aware Blackstones were involved in making agricultural machinery including me. However they were not "Famous" for these paticular products. They were however World wide recognised for their "ENGINES" which made them "famous" The DVD makes a different statement and does not mention the diesal engines and various other type of engines that Blackstones manufactured and supplied throughout the World. These engines were the product that put Blackstones on on the map "so to speak" and resulted in them being famous. The statement I made (Engines Yes argricultual machinery No) relates to what made them famous and does not imply they did not make agriculural machinery, if one researches Blackstons and Lister Blackstones one can see how they became famous. ENGINES. |
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| Clem Walden |
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Hi-Patrick, I agree they made agricultural machinery which was without doubt used on many farms but their "fame" was established through their manufacture of engines which were supplied throughout the World, I have posted info to Betty and you, I wonder if you or Betty have seen the DVD (from which my original comments came from) it is very interesting and well done. But the narrator would seem to have a few minor items wrong. However I would suggest to all they buy a copy as it is well worth watching. |
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| David Leishman |
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Re Blackstones. I found this site to be an interesting read. http://www.oldengine.org/members/blkstone Regards. David. Kate: Thanks for that link David. I cut and pasted into top bar and was soon viewing all the Blackstones gen. Lots to read there for engine buffs. |
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| Patrick |
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I see in the history of The Arts Centre it records that, in 1871, the part now known as the Theatre was opened as the Stamford Billiards, News and Chess Club and stayed open until 1939, I didn`t know that. In his book `Stamford Past` Christopher Davies says that the demolition of the castle remains started in 1933. I expected it was completed and the site cleared by 1935. Roger - Can I buy your video in Stamford, please? |
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| Roger Partridge |
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The Bluecoat started taking girls in 1961/2 at the All Saints Street site as they were building toilets for the girls in the year I left (1961). I think the reference to North St should be East St or Recreation Ground Rd as the old St Michaels School was on the corner and the Bluecoat took that school over around 1961 and used it as an annexe. The castle site was originally levelled to become a car park and did not become the bus station until about 1960. I also saw a Blackstone tractor type seat at a steam rally about 15 yrs ago. |
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| Patrick |
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Hi Clem - Can we agree that Blackstone`s were famous for their diesel engines and well-known for their implements. I worked in the Spares Department there for a few weeks at the beginning of 1947 (on a man`s wage of £3-35 per week). I sent some spares to a diesel engine in Saudi Arabia which, from its serial number, had been made in 1912! |
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| Clem Walden |
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Hi-Patrick, Your wording is agreed. Perhaps I should have made my original posting a little clearer, but after watching the dvd I just felt the narrator's statement about Blackstones being "famous" for its agricultural implements, left the story about this great company only half told. I considered recognition of the Blackstones engines was sadly missed. however your statement is perhaps what the narrator should have used "Well known for their agricultural implements" and famous for their engines. must say Patrick interesting to note you were earning so much money in 1947 (£3.35) and also the mention of the spares you sent to Saudi-Arabia for the diesel engine built in 1912, seems a great shame Stamford has lost all these great manufacturing industries many of which employed the people of this Town when they were operational. Fortunately there are still a lot of Stamfordians that have fond memories of those long gone days and try make sure the records are correct. Kind Regards Clem. |
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| John Tyers |
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£3-35 per week; I wouldn't have thought that was too bad for an adult office wage in 1947. I am told the Blackstones shopfloor skilled machinist rate in 1939 was £3 p.w. but during the ensuing war this was inflated by war bonus, overtime and various other premiums which meant for many years following the war, shopfloor workers, anxious to preserve their differentials, jealously guarded their wage rates which in general outstripped those paid to white collar workers which was the same situation in many local firms including Allis-Chalmers, Essendine where I worked for many years. This is all rather remote from "old films of Stamford" but is a part of the local social structure and old local engineering environment! |
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| CLem Walden |
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Hi-Roger, your posting regarding girls toilets 1961/2 being constructed at the Bluecoat School (All Saints Street) I agree with, I also agree with your comments regarding the Bluecoat School using the old St Michaels School as an annexe, "St Michaels School as most will remember was actually in "Recreation Ground Road" Or at least the entrance to the same was. But I am given to understand the Bluecoat was still a boys only school as late as 1964? (must say I am not sure if this is correct) Regarding your statement about the "Castle Site" being levelled for a "Car Park" this is correct "but it was only the mound of the old Castle site that was levelled for the car park at the time" As you say the Bus station came much later. Prior to this Bus Station deing developed most will remember all buses opperated from "Station Road" that had a Gents toilet adjacent. The old Cream Bus service (Harry Patches) and visting buses used Station Road for many years. "Star Lane" was another area that was used by Delaine and Eastern Counties sevices. Mkt Deeping, Bourne, Etc. United Counties had their depot in the old Chas Grays yard In those days, and they would pick up and drop off passengers for Ketton etc at St Peters Hill "that also had a gents toilet adjacent" They would also pick up and drop off at the area that is at the base of the present bus station, "outside what once was the old waiting room" this also had " toilet facilities" In later years this area became a taxi rank but has in the last three years been refurbished and decorated with a "tree" Roger I am pleased that your memory is sound, I fully agree the present Bus Station was not construction until 1959-60 It seems to me a great shame that many who write books, or produce DVDs fail to record the true facts, the same could be said about some of the new interpretation boards recently installed within the Town. That should record history and state facts "But do not" please pay a visit to the latest board installed at the "Lamas Bridge" you will see as I have seen this board states "The Castle mound was levelled in 1936 to make way for the "present Bus Station? this interpretation board is for the benefit of those visting this Town, and has in my opinion many errors, all of which I have drawn to the attention of those responsible for installing the same. Only to be told this is only an interpetation board "to give visitors information? My point was then and still is History should be always recorded correctly in order that all future generations I aware of what actually took place. Sorry to say I lost the battle and the board was installed. |
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| Roger Partridge |
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Hi Clem For some strange reason I always remember that several of us who were leaving the Bluecoat in 1961 felt cheated that next term when we wouldn't be there, girls would be. It didn't occur to us they would have been 3/4 yrs younger than we were. But I don't know if the girls actually did start then. Thanks for reminding me of all the bus stops that existed before the bus station. The town certainly needed the bus station! I've got a book of Bedford buses of 50s/60s and there is a photo of a Barton Bedford bus waiting in Station Road with an Eastern Counties bus behind and you can see the top part of Motors and Tractors garage/showroom. I completely agree with all your comments about Lammas Bridge misinformation board and the necessity of proper research and correct information. |
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| John Tyers |
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Got to agree with Clem! A lot of things are advertised about the town naturally to only project it in the best light for prospective tourists. I remember years ago trying to tell some Peterborough friends about the notorious Stamford courts which were extant until the late forties but was virtually accused of exaggeration to the point of downright lying! We lived opposite the Drill Hall in St Peter's Street but the entrance to Dixon's Court was by the side of our dwelling and I well remember some of the families who lived there who were eventually rehoused by the Council much to their benefit. |
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| John Tyers |
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Surprised to see mention of a Barton Bedford followed by an Eastern Counties in Station Road. I may be wrong, but always thought when the former took over W.H.Patch Cream Bus Service they only ever ran from the Castle Hill Bus Station and Eastern Counties used Star Lane to/from Market Deeping along with Delaine and Shaws services. It has always surprised me when considering how prolific and in the public eye Patch's buses were for so many years, that there are not more published photos of their buses. I have only been able to find one on the web which is of an ex London Transport RT double decker standing at Bishops Road Bus Station, Peterborough. Dare I say, in their time they were more prominent than the Delaine who have had a book published which contains many photos of their buses. |
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| Clem Walden |
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Hi-Roger, 3-4 yrs younger? that would have been a big difference then if one was only 14-15? however not such a big difference when one is 22? or considerably older?. Re-the girls "Like you state" I am not sure when they actually started? perhaps someone out there will let us both know? I agree with you Town at the time certainly needed the Bus-Station which all may remember was constucted in the days when Stamford was in control of its own destiny pre-1974. Regarding the Lamas bridge interpretation board much of the information was gleaned from the archaeological studies that took place in 1978, other information has been taken from various books and written reports that can in many cases be questioned. History is being made by the hour and has been recorded for centuries by those who were living at the time. The question I ask is how can someone re-write what was once written by individuls that were living at the time? Perhaps in years to come our decendents will be reading an interpretation board (fixed on a wall miles outside Stamford) that states:- "Stamford was a small village 8 miles to the South of this very spot in the County of Leicestershire"? Perhaps when you look at the Lamas Bridge board again you will check the drawing on the base which shows the original Mill Stream (which was filled in) one can observe that it flowed through the Kings Mill wheel race downstream to the Town bridge as Kings Mill is clearly shown on this drawing. One wonders why this drawing fails to show the new Mill Stream flowing through the Kings Mill wheel race? Unfortunatley this drawing indicates the stream flowing from somewhere in the first meadow. But we all know the present Mill Stream still today 2009 runs through the Mill Race at Kings Mill in the same way as it always has done. There are other boards I could mention (St Peters gate board for one) however perhaps I should leave that for the future. it seems to me there are a few of those who recently moved here (very sensible move) who like to make changes and do so without regard for the previous scripted records and history that was once written by indivduals who lived in and around the area at the time? Thanks for your support Roger. |
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| Clem Walden |
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Hi-John, Thanks for your support, you are correct" To project it in the best light for prospective tourists and visitors" But I believe tourists and visitors should be given true facts and not fiction. Interesting to note the old cast plaque that once was fixed to the Castle wall informing all about the history of the same has been removed. By whom I do not know? I was however informed that the information on this plaque was not correct? the indidual who told me this has lived here for 14 years? so must know? I reminded this particular individual history takes place by the hour, I explained, "here I am telling you about the Schools I attended (all of which are gone today) I asked this individual, "who had no factual knowledge of these schools" to remember my conversation, why came the reply? my answer was very simple "I am living today" but when you are my age I will not be around" and I just hope you will remember those schools for they are part of the history of this Town, and I would not like to see those that come after me re-writing the facts I have just given you. Of course we all know that history and records are very often questioned and changed but I often wonder why some changes are made when the change makers have the opportunity to consult with those that still live and remember the true facts. |
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| Roger Partridge |
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Hi John I think you may be right to doubt the Eastern Counties bus. The photo is black and white and the bus is clearly a Bristol, has the (Northants) reg (according to caption) HBD 833 and Corby is on destination board, so I believe caption is wrong and it is in fact a United Counties bus. |
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| Clem Walden |
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Hi-John, you mention "Notorious Stamford courts late 40s" you may find the following history of Stamfords Gaol of some interest:- On the 26th February 1842 a Mr James Graham at Whitehall received a special report from the inspector of prisons, pointing out the following faults with the Stamford gaol:- Female prisoners of all ages had only one small room which they occupied day and night along with the male prisoners, both untried and convicted, all associated together with no matron in attendance. In consequence the male gaoler had to perform the combined duties. there was no Chaplain in attendance so prayers were read by any of the prison officers. It was requested these matters were put right as soon as possible. The last time the old gaol was used was the 12th April 1879. The gaol still situated under the present Town Hall was modernised in the late 1990s but ceased to be used in 2003. Notorious in the 40s! beyond belief previous, Open days at the Town Hall are well worth a visit the old "Dungeons" can still be visited. |
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| John Tyers |
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Re the old schools Clem, there is very little recorded now about St.Martin's C of E Boys Elementary on the corner of High Street St.Martins's/Kettering Road. Everyone knows it now as the High School Music School and newcomers would'nt know of it's previous history. However many of us attended there from the old St.John's and St.George's infant schools together with the odd dilutee from St.Augustine's RC school. There were even three lads from Wittering and one commuting in from Little Bytham while I was there. At one time, it was a mixed school as my mother-in-law went there during WW1. Even in my day 1942-46, the old boys and girls toilets titles were still named on the wall, even though girls had not attended there for very many years! |
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| John Tyers |
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I really meant Clem the old slum courts of Stamford but your piece about the treatment of prisoners in the local legal system was of great interest! Britain's Court, Brooke's Court, Gooch's Court, Dixon's Court and the rest all existed; I think it was Dr E.C.Till who described them and the prevalent ailments such as rickets in children and periodic typhoid outreaks among the inhabitants in his authorititive book on the town. A communal water pump in the yard and only a few toilets between a number of homes sufficed. Plenty of old 'uns still about who can remember the courts and the good old days! After both world wars, you have to give the then central governments credit for financing and sponsoring nationwide council house building and eventually demolishing the good old Stamford Courts. |
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| Clem Walden |
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Hi- John, You are correct, Dr. E.C Till did describe the prevalent ailments within the courts times must have been very hard in those days, but all these courts were not slums? communal water pumps and central toilets were not the sole reasons individuals suffered from the varios ailments at the time, ones diet in most cases caused many problems then? One court you mention " Gooch's" which should be spelt with a "C" Cooch's" this stood in Bath Row and was built in 1872 and modelled on a Glasgow Tenement type structure a Victorian terrance that consisted of 6/7 dwellings and was the only "notorious slum" in Bath Row. Not the whole of the east end of Bath Row as the interpretation board recently installed proclaims. Central Goverment as you quite rightly state took on the challenge and built council housing pulling down all these old courts, unfortunatley following Goverments decided to sell off those council houses that the tax payers paid for. leaving rather a large void for those who are unable to buy or even get their foot on the ladder today. I would like to see a move towards more Council houses being built for those who cannot afford the high rents in the private sector. |
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| Clem Walden |
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Hi-John, sorry for my earlier mistake re:- courts? please forgive me. |
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| John Tyers |
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It's a bit of a paradox Clem, on the one hand is it right to sell off houses built for the common good with public money or does the long term tenant not deserve to buy his house if he has invested a significant amount of his own money to improve the property. Whilst living in my first house in Essex Road, our next door neighbour was a first war veteran who had moved into the property when it was first built. He had spent a lot of money on it but used to say to me it was a lost cause as it would never be his and when he and his family were gone so any benefit would pass to the new tenants! Nevertheless with an expanding population eventually I think it will be necessary to embark on a council house building programme again. |
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| patrick |
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Blackstones again (with the Editor`s kind permission). I was speaking today to the lady who ran the Wages Dept. for the Works Dept. in the 1940s. She told me that the average number on the payroll (apart from office and admin. staff) was around 600. I thought it was worth a note. |
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| tim musgrove |
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i was searching on youtube and came across some film which includes stamford its colour and said to be 1939 and follows a trip from london up the a1 up to grantham it shows st martins, the george, st marys street and st johns street looking uo to red lion sq. go to www.youtube.co.uk then serach for " huntley film archive 1939" and it is down as "great north road 1939" its only 6.53 mins long and stamford starts around 5 mins coming along the a1 from wansford Kate: How great. Had a look at this it is amazing to see how the road looked then. Especially the bit where the cars go up St. Mary's Hill, along St. Mary's Street and through the square. Was this really the A1???!!! Yes, I know it was but it seems impossible now. The bit going through Wansford is amazing too. Thanks very much Tim. I am sure loads of people will enjoy having a look at this. |
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| Helen Clarke |
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I am a teaching assistant at st georges school and we have a engraved stone in the lobby. On this stone is engraved 23rd july 1960 and we are trying to find why it was laid. The arch bishop of lincoln presented it but no one has any record does anyone know anything.. |
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| syd |
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St. Georges School was built by Clarke and Belton, a Stamford building firm on or around that date, so I suppose that would be the date of the laying of the stone or the date the school was opened |
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| roger |
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Dear Clem, Sorry for not replying to you earlier. I lost the link to this website and have only just looked at it all again. Many thanks for all your comments on the DVD I made. Sorry obviously if I got a number of things wrong, but I did my reseach in books and newspapers and some specialist publications. I would like to talk to you sometime as I know you knew my family and it would be fascinating to talk over things. Roger |
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| Keith Hansell |
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Roger I only managed to see your DVD for the first time this morning. I was particularly interested in the clip from the old St Georges School in Wharf Road. Where did you manage to get the film from? I recall a Miss Harrison being our teacher about 1956/7 and she owned a cine camera. One day we all went for a lesson in the park and she took some film of us running about the trees. A short time after our parents were invited to the school one evening to view the footage. I wonder what happened to Miss Harrison and also the footage. |
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| Lynne Cook |
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Hello can anyone tell me. Is this dvd still available and how could I get hold of a copy? |
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| Keith Hansell |
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Either try Walkers book shop, tourist info at the Arts Centre or www.railwayvideo.com |
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| Lynne Cook |
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Thanks Keith I have ordered one from the website |
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